Input sound file: 0493_The_BeanCast_Marketing_Podcast_Technological_Screw
This episode of the bean cast is brought to you by flub natural, see for yourself, what a super burst of flub animals can do for your brain and physical health. Good. If lava natural dotcom and use the offer code Bob for 20% off your first order bandwidth with provided by recursive squirrel, interactive transcription services provided by transcribed me dotcom visit them on the web@transcribed me dotcom slush being cast for up to twenty-five percent off. That's transcribe me. Dotcom episode
493 technological screw. For Monday, April 30th 2000 team, it's time for this week's edition of the beam cast a weekly
discussion about the news and issues facing marketers today. I'm your host, Bob normal. Thanks for joining us. Hi tech offers lots of promises to brand managers, but within a violation of a fever pitch not to mention the cost of training employees and every you platform. Many marketing leads feel reluctant to delve too deeply.
How should I handle this? Will discuss also do bronze still need a social presence, Amazons ever growing at business, unpacking out of home advertising for networks. Plus this week's at fell five. That's the lineup. Lets me tonight. Thanks for joining us for this week's been cast. I'm Bob north and
with me on the panel for this evening, we start with the editor of ad pulp and creative director of bone hook, marketing, mister David Byrne. Hi, David. Hi Bob. Thank you so much. Great to be back on my pleasure to have you on the next up. We have the founder of future 4th author, speaker mister Dave Delaney. Now this isn't going to get confusing two days on the same show one's David ones, Dave [laughter]. And it reminds me of a good old kids in the hall song are the days. I know.
That's fantastic. Now, also with us, we welcome back research director for customer experience, a gardener mister Augie Ray. Hi. Hello good evening, and I just want to say happy national shrimp scampies. Scampi day fantastic areas. And finally, we have board member of mashed burn enterprises and president and chief creative officer of all scope mister Jonathan sack at his ear pi- Jonathan
pay Bob Higa hit you guys I gotta tell ya. I made friends on the pre show. [laughter]. This has been great. Lots of technical difficulty. I think that's what technical difficulties will do. They make friends in the net worth and Antarctic revolve lived through something. Well, let's jump right into the topics of first up every time you turn around these days there seems to be another bright and shiny tool in the ad tech arsenal. But
for brain managers and marketing leads as a whole, there's a double problem. Brewing one is obviously that it's complicated deciding which tools to deploy and training employees to use them is always difficult. But the second is the scary proposition that going to deep too quickly. Could be disastrous when the next big thing arrives on the scene and you've already invested millions and outdated technology. So David, we all agree that keeping pace with innovation is essential
for brands, but how can a brand justify going deep on a technology when the pace of development will make the investment obsolete within a year? I mean, what's your take on on this situation? Cheese Bob tough question. You do realize on a creative director identify the words. I don't know anything about this. I don't even know anything about media bias [laughter]. I'm about to say with a grain of salt and and gentlemen. Please jumped in to help me. But anyway, thank you for the question. I do think that that there
is a line to be drawn on how much can be brought in house. It seems that everything under the sun is being brought in house today, and I think there are some very good reasons for it. In this particular case, add fraud and all the money that people have wasted companies have wasted. Many millions of dollars is clearly a great impetus to look at this and say, we must be able to do this better. If we can't trust our
vendors who can we trust, we could hire own team, we can save money. So I definitely see some good in it. But I do think it's all about the scale of your company, the culture of your company, as to whether the it. It even makes sense to put this type of investment. In your own in house team. And technology instead of religious, hammering out a better deal with your your vendors and understanding more about this data
science and how to manage it. You know, I love your lump. Your answer is going mainly because there's a there's logic to why asked this question to you first? It's because you don't know a lot about the technology and the decision making process going through things. And I think that's what a lot of ran managers feel. I mean, they are really good managing their brand, the really good at managing the people within the recommendation. They have great grasp of the
strategies going forward. But the technology mystified as many brand managers and many creative marketing weeds. And I think that is a problem. I mean, it makes it so that it's all truce ultra difficult to make a decision on which platform to go forward with. And I think that your answer is highlighting exactly what the problem is. You know, with such an O peak situation that you're dealing with in in trying to figure out which particular marketing platform is the best choice
for your brand, and you're gonna spend millions of dollars on it. How do you make that decision when you know that within six months, the entire landscapes going to be changed? And it's going to be potentially a losing proposition to invest in this platform right now. I mean, can king you see the logic and why I'm going after you first David. I mean, I could s- I could see what it makes me. It makes me laugh because what I really wanted to say was. So let me get
this straight. If I understand this, what we're talking about is programatic and display ads. So at the end of the day, we're going to get better delivery. Of display ads, snow, we're tells me that we're talking about the broad scope of marketing ad tech. We're talking about the email, tremendous integrating email into your ad, spend into your serum platform into you know all the different ways that you interact with your customers, your
social platforms. There's so many tools out there to manage all these marketing requirements on a daily basis that it becomes your attack. Y- it can be it certainly can be. Yeah, I think that. You go ahead, it's you're out a lot of really interesting and related topics, one of which is that the technology is going to continue to evolve, and it seems to leave everyone behind the other. Is that. There's really a need for
talent. That in order to keep up with the stuff and and to know how to connect it all and make it work and and organizations really struggle with that. Some of them and outsourcing it. But the thing that I really liked about you mentioning see around us at the important aspect here is that regardless of what happens with the technology, you need to get your first party date in order at truthfully. That's a lot of the problem with at technology. So a part of me that wants to say, and I understand that this is pretty crude and a little naive, don't worry about the
technology worry about getting your data ready, because that will benefit you whatever happens in the future. But this is always going to be a struggle. I mean, it's a it's an arms race yet. Oh, go ahead. Going up. So these are great plans. All I was going to say was that and I've worked for companies in the past where we've made that mistake purchasing and training on soft that ended up being, you know, a failure at the end of the day, which ended up costing tons of money. I think a big part in it is about your network as
well. You know, getting to the Sierra em tea, but getting tear your actual personal professional network and being able to tap the shoulders of industry people. To be able to ask them their opinions, unlike if you're looking at vendor a better product, a b, or c, as let's say, in this case, you're C r. M solution and getting talking to colleagues and people that work in either in the same industry or even competing industries. Because at the end of the day, a C r. M is this year. Em. But talking to them and finding out what they're using, the pros and cons and then getting a
almost like going on when you travel to leave, never been to go on Facebook. And you say, I'm going to Baltimore for my first time. What should I do there? And all your friends chinamen. Right. It private. It's not just it's not just the fact that you might make a decision that's wrong, just flat out wrong and you need to get the best advice from people. It's the fact that there's so much being developed that is completely unknown to you. And within six to twelve months, it could be completely changed the landscape.
So why invest deeply on one platform when you know that it may go away within a year and you may need to go into a completely different platform. It's the same thing with like buying new technology that so expensive his at at some point, you've got to bite the bullet, or you're still going to have a flip phone. But there's still there's still at least with technology of like a 2 3 year cycle. You know the pace of technology innovation in the ad tax base is like every three months. Yet not I I I agree with that. I think what I would add to this is I think we all
agree there is nobody better at understanding at tech, the Jonathan Sackett think we all are, but [laughter] okay, but that but that being said, I would say this, the rule of thumb for me has always been I'd been you know, chief digital officer couple, the couple of the biggest firms. And what I've found is that cutting edge can make you bleak. And I think that you have to have one foot in reality in one in the future, but you have to you have to tread to Bob to your point. You have to
toll lately when it comes to the future, because where are you going to your bets? The thing is, is that the you've got to think a lot of this comes down to trust. Whether it's your vendor, your partner, or somebody who's employed by you, you'd have to know that that 24 year old kid is going to know the technology heck of a lot better than you. But you have to ground that 24 year old kid inexperience. Right. It's going to be a yin Yang affect the way I see it. But like I said, I think it comes down to cutting edge can make you bleed. It doesn't. It's not always
the biggest baddest best because it's the first because let's face it. Yahoo was before Google. Like would argue was Saint about giving the data together because that that to me seems to be critical add. It's the cart before the horse. We want to try this great technology or send out this great campaign. We have all this. We have these lists. But as a creative person, I'm always sitting there, wondering, I've spent hundreds of hours developing aimee's direct mail campaigns for sure would
have her, but who were they going? And that seems to me to be sort of like the miss seem. Magic in in a lot of this is that were supposed to know our customers were supposed to know our prospects, which we're supposed to be able to do one to 1 and and experiences all this. But you know, it seems to me that that isn't happening. And that that that's a concern. You know, one of the things that always bothers me about any kind of new
technology new implementation is that we tend to forget the basics of marketing, which is be objective driven. You should be able to point to a specific objective that you're trying to achieve as a marketing department and say that this particular platform is the best solution for this marketing problem. And that's what we should be striving for. I get the feeling that a lot of players out there in the in the the marketing space are so focused on.
We need a marketing technology platform and we need to set, you know, they forget the set objectives or even worse because this platform is able to do things that they really don't understand yet. They're not able to set objectives that are better meaningful for the brand because they don't understand that it's possible to actually solve a problem. That they didn't realize was a problem, Dave, what? What's your take on that situation? I mean, it's just like you said that you've actually been in that
situation yourself em yet actually been. Deciding what kind of platform to use the do you find objective setting to be lax, or was it you know, completely on board? In the example that it had I mean, people were on board with the with what we are trying to achieve with what we will we had purchased, the trouble was that it just was had too many kings in it. And had we perhaps done better due diligence on vetting that software. We might have known ahead of time,
maybe not to go for that, or maybe it wasn't quite ready for prime time. So was it not in not meeting your objectives, or were you just really didn't fit the software or enough to know that it wasn't meaning your objectives, or was it more that there was more that needed to be done that you were ready for when the software started to actually Europe? Yeah, I think ultimately, it just wasn't. Yeah, I just didn't. It wasn't, I think and I wasn't in
the buying side of of the decision side of the software, so I was really just a user of it. So, but it was a logistics off are basically and it just did not. It didn't do what it was supposed to do, and we ended up having to spend tons of money on consultants coming in to help us customize a software to to meet our needs. And then at the end of the day, we realized this as it just isn't doing it. Well, because it's so complicated, I think we're seeing people turned to some of the more of those walled gardens, right? I mean, Facebook
face, booking Google for for for all of their challenges, make things pretty easy if you want a target at tech seems to make it difficult. And I know that, you know, again overly broad one is becoming more difficult. The other hopefully will become easier. But I do think that marketers are beginning to. Gravitate to things that they understand better things that they find easier and let's face it. Things that are less costly in the end in terms of making it turns, making your money work for you.
It would, at that point needs to be highlighted Augie. Because what, what do think the underlying thing that you're saying is the because walled gardens works so well. It makes them a safer bed to go for. And so in that same spirit is the bigger platforms, you know, you're you're cells forces your adobe's of the world. They may not be perfect, but are they a safer bed because they represent a bigger garden that you can
play in and actually gives you the opportunities of emanates and doesn't make you have the bed on a single player, but you can bet on one player that is. Bringing all these different factors in in the bed with you and I know that I'm not I'm not here advocating for one of the big platforms. It's just more from a practicality standpoint. Does it make more sense? To go after the big platforms into invest only in in those types of players as opposed to the
smaller players. I mean Augie would you would you say that be the case, or would you argue against. Well, I think it depends on the size of the client, right? I mean, so if you're a really large client, you've got opportunities to hire better talents. And you've also got some opportunities to spend a little money piloting things with some of those up and coming. You know, a new ad tech sorts of platforms. I think if you're orbit sized, you get a stick with what works in. You're going to stick with something that is you point out, you know is
going to continue to stay at the cutting edge. And maybe as a result, you could have to relearn the whole bloody world every six months because you think comes along. So I, you know, I definitely think there's part of it, but. You know, ultimately, the other thing that we really haven't really talked about it but added costs a lot. When you begin to look at the value chain and everyone gets there there, you know, if your blood, what are the benefits of using some of the other things too? Is that your money works a little harder for you? So I I just
think a lot of this is going to get easier. I hope it gets easier because I just think it's ridiculously complex right now. Dave, would you agree. Yeah, no, I I definitely agree. I I really do think you know, without without speaking to what specific platform we're talking about, right? Like I think it depends on the size of your business. It depends on what it what solution you're trying to find. So if it's like a C r. ramping than and you're a large company to maybe sales first
force makes sense, right? But if you're a smaller company and and it's maybe not as he are aimed, but something like now now a social media monitoring system or something, then then maybe you could test the waters. It was something small and new. But at the end of the day, yeah, I think I think if you're a large band brand with a lot at stake, been sticking with the trusted names is probably a good idea. If you use like Marquette or something like that, and you for on the fundamentals and
really worked your list and then they get acquired to go out of business. It's fine. You could. You could go to sales force at that time. You've done the hard work. And then I think that's the important thing right is, is to learn how to use these systems. Yeah, it's also finding out whether the whether you can export and import into 1 1 to the other like I know like I've had a blog that I moved from, WordPress a square space and I could import on my blog content from work, press square space release really
easily. So and vice versa by the way. So yeah, if this offer these solutions play well together and that's a that's a that's a bonus right there. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, knowing about data portability is an essential question right from the start, and it goes right back doggies initial comment, get your data straight, get did all on order. Well, we're going to move on and we're going to talk next about whether a brands actually still need a social presence. It's an interesting argument based on an actual
situation in the u k, we'll get to that in just a minute, but first. I want to talk about chocolate the flannel antioxidants and dark chocolate or great for you and no-one, no-one, absolutely. No one. I'm not going to guarantee it. I'm just saying no one does chocolate better than our sponsors flava natural look here are the facts. Science supports that the of animals and dark chocolate benefit brain function. They benefit heart health and they benefit exercised performance. But the trouble is
to get enough lab animals from your average dark chocolate to actually see these benefits. You're going to have to eat like five bars or more, which is not good for your waistline. You're going to get fat eating that much chocolate. That's why we were so excited to discover the flag of natural system. Now, here's how it works. One in natural barmaid from ultra premium cocoa beans crams in the flat in all benefits of five typical dark chocolate bars at 1:5th, the
calories and the sugar free mixes. The benefits of nine count him nine typical dark chocolate bars with even fewer calories. Put her altogether, and let me tell you with all the stuff I've been eating recently. I'm feeling like a super strong brainiac you'll miss stuff. It's amazing because they they did they ship me a whole bunch of product than I am. Absolutely loving it. Now, these bars with some of the best tasting chocolate bars I've ever had, I not exaggerating. These things are delicious Whitney think so I think so.
And I took their 10 day challenge with their mix by simply adding it into my morning Cup of coffee, and I could immediately feel the benefits. I'm sounding smarter on a I mean, when I'm on the show on sunny smarter, it's because I'm eating chocolate. Which brings me to the big opportunity for you. My high functioning chocolate enhance brain tells me that you may want some delicious, super chocolate as well. And if so, I can get you some for 20% off. Just go to F l. A v.
a natural.com. That's flat in natural.com. What are the 10 day challenge packet get some bars detri-? Why not order a couple cases for the entire office. You got an office manager around, tell them I want chocolate in the break room and check out. You just entered her the offer code Bob, that's B o. B just look for that offer code block in entering Bob for a 20% discount off the entire order. But hurry offers going to end on July 30 first. So
you want to get out ordering soon. But site again is flat financials dotcom offer code Bob. If chocolate is your weakness, let flower nostrils be your strength. And we thank them very Mark much further support of our show. While I love doing chocolate ads on this program, it's such a fled. The natural while I hope y'all order some because it's amazing. I love this stuff, especially especially the coffee one. I love that coffee bean chocolate. It's amazing.
Well anyway, getting back to the show a chain of 900 pubs in the u k did a remarkable thing JD weather spoon decided to close down, not one, not too, but all of their social media presence, all of their accounts claiming that after weighing benefits against liabilities, they believed that the move would recreate no lasting or no meaningful impact on their business. You this seems like
a play out of your play book. I mean, you're always talking about the fact that brands are doing crazy stuff on social media, but is it wise to completely shut down all of your accounts? What? What's your take on this move by Judy weather spoon? Yeah, listen, I've been down or at least realistic about social media as a marketing mechanism, at least from the organic perspective. I think we've all got in there now, but four or five years ago, and I started talking about it. People thought it got a little crazy, but back to
the matter is, is it still makes sense for brands to be on social media. And the reason to be there isn't because you the brand or not getting what you want, it's because customer is expected to be there, and there are benefits that accrue ice. I think the real challenge is that this organisation failed to figure out how to scale efficiently managing what it was doing, a social media. And as a result, it pulled a yank, the court now. The thing that that's frustrating to me is that customers do in fact check.
Facebook and Twitter and other places for information about brands in restaurants, and there's plenty of data at the Simon atlas. So I go out looking for data 37th study by toast, which is a digital platform for restaurants. Valid social media was the most common platform for a restaurant advertising, a 20 17. And of course if you're not if you don't have profiles, there's no reason to do a whole lot of advertising. They're saying it, did it interesting. A study that found that 75% of the diners you say they brows food photos say that they've
actually chosen a place to eat based on social media and h g, which is aspect or change g e at which the hospitality management firm said the two thirds of consumers overall will say they'll visit or restaurant social media pages before they eat there. Now, you know, I don't know that all those data, all those data points are exactly believable. They don't necessarily. Beat taste test, but even if their directly accurate, there's just no reason for a restaurant or frankly, most other brands not to be there. You can
only ask questions are going to take photos. They're going to up look at Facebook in the recommendation feature, which I'm sure you've all seen. If I'm at ever get reckon I'm absolutely sure your 100% right about this, that people will say, and actually follow through on going to social media pages before they visit a restaurant. But if they don't find the social media page, what's the next solution? They just Google it. And if you're there for googling in any way, and they're seeing all these pictures and they're
getting all the information about the restaurant in there. Able to look at reviews via Google. Why should you bother with the social media account? I mean, just because they are going to you on fresh on Facebook doesn't mean that they're not going to turn around and goes Google you in the end and find you anyway. Well, here's here's I want to bring up a quick story we we had a 1 point had managed all 16 brands of Tylenol. Okay? So we were the agency of record for them and Johnson and Johnson had a.
They they had a mandate from their attorneys to not be present on social media, unless they felt confident that they could respond to every single posts on every single site everywhere every time. Okay. A don't get me started on pharmaceuticals. They were under some massive Rouge aberrations in terms of the social things. All. Yeah, it's ridiculous. But here here's the here's the concern when when children's liquid Tylenol was taken off the shelves temporarily, because there were supposedly metal shavings in in the
product to gaze. Remember this at all? Yeah. Okay. So what happened was it will it was not metal shavings. It was duct tape. So some pieces came off of a pipe somewhere and got into the product. Well, what happens is if you don't have a social media presence, you can't come back the negativity. And what happens is now. The this madness mother of mom group. Came out and said, the Tylenol is putting metal in our children's medicine. So if you don't own
your social media presence, somebody else will. So I always look at it that your social presence, your digital footprints, whatever you want to call it, your ecosystem. It has to be the game of risk. Were you plant your armies all over the anybody? Younger is going to what the hell of talking about, but you plant your armies for offense and defense, and that's what your social presence needs to do. And if you don't own it, somebody else will. And that's even more dangerous. The thing is though there has to be a there there when you
arrive as a consumer. So what's the point of arriving on a Facebook page for a restaurant or some other business that isn't managed is updated? Doesn't you know. Build the brand or really interest you even to go there. So I think I think there's this management question, especially. When you have a retail chain and each. Unit has their own social presence Ari. I does this.
There are south Florida, so. Their social media platforms that are designed obviously for distributed organizations like this, and while. Generally, I will tend to agree with you that having something current and fresh is important for a small restaurant chain. If your photos of your food or a month old, that's to me doesn't mean nobody's going to see it or or care should they arrived there? More important though, I think is when people ask questions, right, right yet, don't Sierra open hours, or
they've got a complaint, or they've got a concern, or they want to know if your gluten free. You know, most people are going to turn a social media these days. And while you're part your point may be accurate. Bob, that people will ultimately that just go to Google. I still think that you're missing out of that. People do have an expectation that branch will be there. They do have a preference for engaging with grants in certain ways, at least some people do. And ultimately, if if it's if we're going to melt the argument that people can always do acts, if you don't do why
that's like, well, why have thoughts? They can ask you their questions, it. So you know it to me, it's it's a very meal oriented thing. It reminds me in 20 14 and other U k. company. Ironically 24 famously cancelled their Facebook page and made a big blog posting a blank Facebook in its because Facebook allied to us, we're not getting what we wanted out of it. And I wrote a blog post back that same argument. It's very me, focus its, why aren't I? Am I not getting what I expected out a Facebook and go ahead and checking 20 force
back on face. And I think I think I want to clear I want to clarify too for you argue because I actually I I do agree with you. I think that the the move to go completely off of social media is a knee jerk reaction. That doesn't really have an objective behind it. Other than to sterling objectives. Oh yeah. Well, I mean, I believe in objectives I talk about objectives. I mean, everything I do is objectively base. I mean, I tried to have that kind of suit the solution approached.
Approach to marketing all the time, but I think something he said we should really highlighted. I mean, there there needs to be a separation between social promotion from social interaction, support needs. You know there, there's. We look at social media as one big blob of tactics, and it's it's not I mean there there is the stuff that David's talking about, which is you go out there and you create content and you interact,
and you actually promote things via social media. And then there's the social reaction platforms where you're basically monitoring what's going on in the marketplace, and you're responding. And I think that out of the two of them, the the latter is the more important thing I've always said. The listening is the most important thing you can do in social media, and if you have a listening campaign and you're using technology to listen to your consumers, you've already got a social media win. Every other decision you make on social media needs to be
taking. Very very carefully and very, very deliberately, because it will get you in trouble. But listening, we'll never get you in the trouble. Yeah. I was going to say I managed to make social media for Griffin technology for about five years back in the day, and I had searches for like 70 different products. Also saved two to search for this product names to see when people are talking about them, and then be very quick to respond. So I think I think when you guys are saying is absolutely correct to meet in the case of this.
This gentleman with these puns, Amin. I think I'll give you mentioned the phone, like if he didn't like the bone, you can't you can't just ignore it right now. People are still talking and I think as a consumer personally, if I talk about a brand on line on social and in someone representing that brain replies to me, I'm I feel great. And so when I get if I tweet what are the hours of this pump? Or I wonder what the menu is today for lunch. If I get a response, I'm way more likely to go and do business with that. I want to give
this guy a little bit of crab because I don't think it's just a publicity stunt. I think he might be aware of worse. My Earl, our lie on this. You know, what am I spending? Might get get him. It is legitimate question and it taught in England. People just walk in. Yes, you'd social, but they are they are though I amuse customers are taking photos at the pot and posting them an ensconced they're they're, but they're going to walk in there what they don't strive him
out. Answering the customer care call. And you do it because you have to. It's increasingly I me this is Bob spoilt and it's also been buying on the show and hand off of it is that social isn't monolithic. It isn't one thing. So they took a very marketing oriented approach here. I am not seeing the benefit out of what I am spending. They didn't think about people who are going to ask questions. People were going to ask for recommendations on Facebook and and now you have no location so nobody can recommend you. They
didn't think about things from the customers perspective, and maybe there is supposed to be a directly short term attributable to everything you do. I I still think of it a little bit like the telephone was an amazing inventions that revolutionized everything we do with the organization, but nobody walked around talking about having a telephone strategy [laughter] 28 different ways to make it work. And that's the way social media is. So pulling yourself off. May seem like a smart thing. If what you're doing is
investing in content, you're not seeing return. But you know, three months from now, this is a popular the chain had what 900:9 hearts thousands and thousands of people asking questions and expecting answers and they'll be back. It's a complicated. The I think that there is even more complicated thing about this. There's an even more complicated thing about this particular story in that. If you know anything about the way the pub system works in in in the u
k. You have a holding company that owns a whole bunch of individual pubs that are all named different things like piggin whistle and thumbnail and jerk off. I don't know. But. You know, you have all these different. I love that. I've done go ever going back. Their eyes college are and what happens? What happens is you know, you have no single brand unity over like JD weather spoon. You have a whole bunch of individual pubs. It of all kinds of
different names and being able to have a consistent experience across all these different pubs. Is essential and it's going to happen only through a social Cup for me can't happen through a Google search like I suggested earlier. It needs to happen through this. I think smart about it, he they would create. They would create not a brand guide specifically because each one has its own brand, right? So that makes sense. But at least an overall social media guide to give them
information about how to listen effectively and how to respond and what to do in a negative situation. Or positive situation, both situations. But by the way, there's more to this story too, because the garden, the guard, I read a guardian article about it and used. He was four bricks it and very vocal about it. And so they got a lot of negative reviews because of an be vocal about brags it. And I think that's part of the reason perhaps why he wanted to shut it off. Okay, well there's nothing wrong with bricks it. It's the
most important meal of the day [laughter]. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. But but the one thing I would say is we can never forget and I want to reinforce this point and I want to hear Bob, they that's a good point, Jonathan. Okay. Everybody ready. Is that good? Social media presence can have soft benefits to. That's number 1. And number two is a good social media presence influences search and it can repress negativities. So if somebody's complaining about your product service
or brand, if you are strong enough out there, the people aren't gonna find that message. They're going to find the message. You want them to find. Good good points, good points. Jonathan club attribute about this pob where there's no one with their phone out. You know, do you ever go to a coffee shop where they don't have WI fi because they are doing that on purpose. So you do not. Sit there with your screen. And in a place under coffee shop or
Pablo who's supposed to talk. I kinda like this. I know I know I knew that you were David [laughter]. I'm the same way with televisions in pubs. I'd prefer poblano T v.s because unless her second major sporting event but but but in most cases, no T v. Jeff letting rallied definitely prefer v.s that get turned off when there's not a sporting event on. Well, I got to move on to the next topic of Amazon's latest financial show us that they're ad businesses. They're
fastest growing sector representing two billion dollars of the revenue. And I know they make a lot of money, but two billion of the ones revenue is a significant portion. The question is day. Does this represent positive news for brands or indicate trouble in the future of maybe a pay to play system from a company that already has a stranglehold on product search visibility and purchasing? Yeah, I don't. I don't. It's it's a great
question and it really interesting story by up by and I think I think it's it's not that rains are in trouble so much as it's brains have to be on point and understand how to use Amazon's advertising platform and start using it now so that you know and understand how to use it. I've read that predictions by Khan score estimate that more than 50% of searches will be coming will be voice based by 20 20 and I'm really interested in how that will play a part in this because. With echo you, most people have an echo
now, or the Alexa will answer user anytime you ask Alexa to add something to your shopping list. You know, that's the key part of this. And I find really interesting with with how ads will work as well as is how it plays into these smart speakers. Well, that's what I mean by visibility because it's like when you're when you're searching on Google, yes, Google holds a stranglehold on search. We know that. But at the same point, once you get off of Google, you end up on a website that has
more information that you can then in Iraq with the brand directly and possibly become a loyalist whereas with the Amazon's search engine, which is more about retail, you never leave Amazon. Your entire visibility is based on that Amazon experience. And then as a brain manager is both is very important as you as you wisely call out. But it's also troubling to me. It is. It is. Yeah, absolutely. By do find
that I'm still I'm so hooked on the idea of smart speakers and how like one in every six Americans now has a smart speaker, right? So. And we go to Amazon to shop that we go to Google the search and may be shot, but Amazon is where we go to shop in, spend our money. So it makes complete sense why why they're being is as successful as they are right now in the and yeah, I mean, that's why it's so important to have this as part of your strategy, or at least be thinking about this memo board in the future.
To the one in six people on this call, how the smart speaker I do. I have avoided them, avoided them, like the plague. I don't know why is I'm not I'm not fearful of technology, nor am I necessarily fearful of having a microphone in my in my apartment. Now that I'm no longer doing the station chief with an exceedingly, a station chief not happening anymore. So I'm not worried about that anymore because both Alexa and Google all noodle home to be the better of the two, at least for
now more functional gives you'd better information and answers. The thing is that for all the talk of conversational commerce, I still like the thing that I think we still have to work out like every turn of the technological screw people sort of act as if we are going to reinvent human behavior. What happens is that human behavior changes fairly slowly it. So you know, the internet didn't like revolutionize commerce for really start bouncing organizations
out for 10 or fifteen years, right? Even though some people back in 99 and we were saying it was going to happen in the next couple of years. So anyways, my point here is that I don't know that anyone is going to use voice search to buy anything that they need to conduct any sort of research on right. So you'll Saint by kitty litter, and it will put your favorite kitty litter in it. So it's great for those things that Abbas on already knows about you, things you've already bought that. Try try having
somebody tried to buy a little black cocktail dress with their voice. Just just like you. Your parents, dick in what was their names? This would be psyched and a half of them. [laughter]. Kathy tries stuff Augie. I just have to get some clarification here. Did you say technological screw. Did you have ever turn of the because you can lead me. [laughter]
technological screw. Okay. That's the point is that it's not exactly going to I don't think rewrite things quite as quickly as some people are claiming because it is perfect for some things. It just not perfect for others. I'll tell you that when I had the Alexa, I 98% of light use of it was to control spot a fight with each Google home. I will use it to ask questions and get some more information, but there's still pretty basic and crude. So I don't think
we have to to overdo it. But it does force us to think about how we're going to operate in an Amazon world of Amazon. Very with the next couple of years could be one of every two ecommerce dollar spent in the u s at they've got a two billion dollar ad. Network running it certainly does beg some questions about what that means that I think it does. It actually should scare a lotta brands. Well, I want to move onto their final topic of the
evening out of home advertising seems so completely old school and yet not only our digital only companies like net flicks using it like crazy. I mean, just ride on the subways in New York. We've covered the story before technology companies and Apso the highest users of outdoor advertising. In the case of net flicks they're even trying to buy a billboard company. So Jonathan, why is it about billboards that represents such fascination for screen only
products? Why are we so focused on putting stuff out of home when the objective is to get people on a scream? Well, I think we all agree that I know billboard technology better than anybody on the planet [laughter] not technology, not technology because there is no technology and old school billboards that I use as vital covers vinyl wraps. I would. I would have to agree with Augie I think that this is a non technological screw to be honest with you. But I
think I I really I believe this I don't know Bobby, you know the old adage of if you're an advertising agency you by the billboard space because you want the C e. O to see it on the drive in. Yeah, error that of her that saying, right, yeah, so it proves that you're agency is doing their job and all while look at their hemisphere, billboard, and this is my driving to work. But I do think that, you know, let's face it. Technically, hypothetically, you are not supposed to be on your cell phone, looking
at the screen while driving. And I can tell you by the sixteen year old girl who recently hit my car was looking at her screen. I would have been happier, should have been looking at a billboard. But that being said, I think that the it comes down to finding the right initiatives to surround the right audience. And I I still believe that there's there's a need for high touch, low tech initiatives, and I would refer to a billboard is that same thing. I think what happens is if you're
driving into worker whatever, you're the goal of an advertising agencies to keep your brands and the brand's themselves. It's supposed to keep a top of mind and surround the right target at the right time. So. I agree with them to do something like this now. I haven't seen the offset of spend, and to be honest with you, with all of the look at look at, you know, we were agency record of go for years. I mean, how many billboards you see for guy call a ton. So I think that it again, they've got a media budget of
over a billion dollars, you can still surround people properly. I think it's right now. It's either hyper local for billboard, or it's absolute mass, and there's no middle ground because geckos of the world can afford it. And the local restaurant probably needs to afford it. That's the way I look at the one at one of the most one of the best quotes ever heard. And I'm going to butcher this quarter because I can't remember it word for word, but Rashad tobacco Walla. One said at a conference that.
That outdoor advertising represents the last true mass media out there because television is going away slowly into much more of a targeted advertising mix. I mean, it's becoming programatic. It's going online. It's becoming streaming and billboards outdoor advertising outdoor screens. All these different out of home advertising opportunities represent the last true way to get in front of a mass audience with a message. And when you're
trying to advertise a brand new show, it's it's all about mass, right? David? I mean, it's like this is about mass. Yeah, I was going to say to this is an entertainment company content company and know in L a. that's how movies movies. Appear, our outdoor board. So it's a it's currency and apron net flicks to say, we are totally in this city. It here we come and so I think it's
great that they would buy the company itself. Deserts free media placements from now on. And it works too. And I mean, there is a Jarad Leto Leno ladle show on net flicks. It's a new movie. And there is billboards in Nashville where I live and actually saw the billboard. I didn't know about the show it's on the billboard and actually ended up watching the movie. So work for me. What I really love our are creative, billboards that are interactive or or just out of the box, so to speak.
So you look at like a like dove. Always have really creative billboards enter, sorta interactive, and what have you. And I think it's those that are as well, because people start talking about the billboards and I know this is, you know. This isn't like every billboard you see on the interstates type of shale, but when you do, I think there's a good opportunity there too. I was gonna comment earlier, somebody made a comment about how its low tech, but I think anyone, if we were had any one other call was actually the billboard business. They would be a reading,
the riot act because. Even even delivering targeting billboard, advertising is technology, much less digital billboards much less as you're pointing out the future of. Oh, digital billboards, which has to be much more interactive. So I think there's a lot of technology there that's coming, but the real point is that I think Bob, you hit the nail on the head is at an age of ad blocking. And we all know that's growing in an age of subscription services that
maybe people watch the advertisements on. You know get- getting through that barrier still take something at billboards, billboards make it happen. I will, depending upon the audience. I mean, I agree with that. I should clarify what I meant when I said low tech, I was talking about the static billboards and I was talking about high touch, low tech initiatives. So you know, if you just gotta static billboard or whatever, obviously for Diccon Kathy tries to offer something like mom and dad, I got it. We were
talking booklets on the pre show. You know, I can't tell you how many times I've helped my parents with their computer. They're fond their questions, and we all have great horror mom story about doing that. I think that you know for for Cracker Barrel, which is a partner of ours, them in particular, the billboards work. Now we were also talking about accountability. So how can you trace that back to that billboard? Well, you can't because it's supposed to be part of the marketing mix, not the end. All. So you can in
some cases though like there's these there's an actual added not far from my house right now. There's this big black billboard with white bull muttering that says something to the effect of your mattress companies are screwing you or something like that. And it just as a euro. And maybe it was because I was in the market for new bad, so I just checked out the euro and and it's and it's an amazing process. It's it's not it's a mattress company, but anyway, it was very creative in. So this year rail had like like a tendencies or
name in the euro out. So they could measure from traffic going to that website too to see. And then one conversions are happened. When when people do you go to the site? I think the you can't underestimate the power of out of home as a whole Buddha's a technology. Well, as the technology is attractive of mechanism and as a mass awareness opportunity, I think it it fits all the checks, all the boxes. Well, with that it's time for the ad fell five but before we get to that segment of the show, I do want to take this quick
opportunity to thank my guess again and allow them to each to a shameless plug starting with David Byrne you can find him@bone hook dotcom that's the home of bone hook marketing. Tell us what's going on in your world, David, what would you like to promote? Oh, thanks, Bob, I appreciate it. I think I'll go ahead and promote myself tonight if that's okay. Recently moved to Austin, Texas, from Portland, Oregon. And been here about a month and been meeting of people looking for new
opportunities. Big small and otherwise, so I'd be very interested in any listeners in the Austin area might want to meet with me over coffee or a beer, or anyone is listening out there might want someone to work remotely. I'd be interested in hearing from you. Thank you. Fantastic. And I've recommended David through an opportunity and they were very satisfied with him, so definitely definitely do that. Next up. We have Dave
Delaney. You can find him at future 4th which is future 4th.com immi- getting the euro correct. The F future 4th F o. R t. H I. actually have F o. U r. T h. that redirect funny page. If you end up there [laughter]. Tell us what would you like to promote? What would you like to tell us about? Yeah, thanks, Bob, and this has been great guys. For me personally, I am a huge fan of improv comedy and trained with second city in Toronto
graduated from there. I used to perform in an improv true, bad, my own improv troop and many. So now in my forties in Nashville every 40 year old dude begin. I user to garage band again. I don't play any things. I'm doing improv again. And when I realized I spoke at hub spots in conference a couple of years ago, and I've started something called my communication reboot. And what I'm doing is working with companies coming in and facilitating improv workshops to improve company culture and communication, and the feedback so far has been amazing, honestly.
So I would love to talk to folks about this while that does sound amazing. So if you've never done in improv workshop for for corporate retreat retreats, it's a fantastic opportunity for you to learn more about how to interact with customers than other types of situations. So fantastic. You're doing that. Next up, we have argued Ray, you can find him a gardener.com where he blogs proficiently [laughter] profusely lots of words. So tell us what's going on
in your world Augie what would you like to promote? Yeah, well, two things very quickly. First, I completed a really big project that is, I sat through vendors affinity war without having to go to the bathroom in the middle of interfering very proud of that. Lord of the point though in a couple of weeks, may 15th, may 17th the cart digital marketing conference is happening at San Diego. It is really a great conference and gets very strong reviews. And I worked with a bunch of very smart people on the marketing team
there. I'm going to be speaking about customer experience, what separates really great experiences from that. So great experiences at how brands could activate and enable those reduce their risk when they're taking some chances. So I'm very proud of what I'm going to be presenting it. I hope some of your listeners, like the at the conference said, well, stop into say high. That sounds great. I would love to go to one of your conferences someday. Maybe Gardner could send me [laughter]. I don't have much full though
[laughter]. Finally, we have Jonathan socket. You can find him@both mash burn enterprises then all scope, which is that all scope dotcom. Tell us what's going on in your world, Jonathan, what would you like to promote? Well, first of all is always had like to promote the shoal so I've been a dear friend of mine for years, and I would hope that people would pass it around Sherrit and sponsor it more importantly, I would also like to promote everybody else on the panel because these guys are
great and you could do a lot lot worse than partnering with any of these guys because we could smart good people. So anything you can do to to help those guys out as well. The last thing that I'll see is we're in the final final stages of acquiring a pod cast called two black guys with good credit. And they've got a huge guy though, it's funny, but they've got a huge following. They've done the NBA playbook for financial stability to help out the athletes, and we're launching through tune
in network a relaunch eating through to the network. And the guest for the may 20 first show is none other than Jamal mash berm. Yeah, and that's in in knowing Jamal for through you know that this is something that near and dear to his heart because he's very much interested in helping young sports stars that have financial stability and actually figure out what they're going to do with all this money that they're making. So definitely will really important thing as for meaning for more information about me or the show
visit being cast dotcom there you can find a complete show archive. You can find out how to consult with me. You can even find out of the advertising the program. So check it all out@the being cast dotcom and don't forget transcribe me.com is now are official transcription partner. So we are providing transcription services finally, no, you guys have been asking for for a while. So to thank them, please go to transcribe me.com slash. Being cast, I believe, and you can get a special discount on any
transcription alter you make so definitely go to that site and give them some business. And now it's time for the ad fell five or run down of the lowest moments in advertising marketing and public relations from the last week. And first up. The ad blocking brave web browser, Jonathan is projected the double its user base, double its user base by the end of the year. Now I know that this is only going from one million, two million before million, and that's only a drop in the bucket in terms of browser usage, but
it does highlight the fact that ad blocking continues to grow because ads soccer, right? It's, I think there's bad ads. There's bad partners in. In some cases, there is just bad agencies. So the us is agency. Owners are going to have to find a way to combat that, and now yet the numbers, I think you're right on the numbers, but still it just goes to show how soon is Google going to buy them out and say, yeah, you're just going away. That's what I'd be concerned about.
Problems adding at blocking. I'm not so sure about that. By the way, I've tried brave. Bad lightning fast. It's an amazing how fast things load when you get no it. Yeah, I've been trying to get to you and I agree. And what's neat, I think about brave is that you as a user can choose to pay the the content producers if you like, which I think is fantastic. You all are traitors. That's all I'm saying you're all trade. Okay. It's called pay to go away.
Next up former vice chairman Vincent the lorry that I get the right Jonathan's boolooroo. So Vincent blurry was officially charged with bribery because he was trying to secure port contracts for his other company by using a vast says, menial arm to help African politicians get elected. David. This sounds like some kind of episode from homeland freeze. All I can say is, you know, can holding
companies just go way. Do we really need to be. Did anybody take ethics in advertising course come on? No, no. That's a big Farah Boston sticking point. He always says the doctors and lawyers have to take ethics courses, but advertisements can just work without any kind of a guidance whatsoever. Act like this was so subtle though that you know this poor experienced person could not have real
exits thick crust alive. Well, apparently it's even worse because our next Advil is apparently mister blurry is not alone in his misdeeds at harass the worldwide director of public affairs. Jean Philippe Durand is also under investigation by French authorities for complicit in his in this whole affair Augie. I'm just saying, harass has some serious problems if all this starts going down because this is an onion ready on [laughter]. Well, let's just say that W p. P would like to
think of us for these headlines. I'm sure they would after a cut right? As if you snap chat uses out there didn't hate advertising enough already. Dave, the month of may will bring you unscripted wool. Video adds, it's fine. Munifi year I, you know, I am ambivalent. I kind of feel like, well, snapshots gotta do something, but I just don't know that this is the right move. Yeah, I I don't think
it's the right new for them, but at least it's only on specific channels. It's not like right across everything you're watching, but I think it definitely is going to annoy its users. And if they are listening on social, which I hope they are, I'm sure there will hear about it, and I'm sure they will as one like the pob guy, right? He's not going to her thing. And finally, finally, will the smaller new front, Jonathan, Jonathan saved the new fronts after last year's disaster. The event is back in a
scaled down form. But does anybody really care anymore? I mean, it's just like the new fronts were there for a specific purpose to get us interested in streaming media, the thing. And now everything is streaming media, even TV's becoming streaming media. So that's what I said when I thought that I thought, what is the what's the objective here? My objective, this is getting getting around, you're getting around. I love it [laughter]. We'll have something to add to this list or just want to discuss it.
Comment on line, use the hash tag, add fell five that's pound Advil. And the number five. Well, that does it for this week's show if you'd like to subscribe to this pod cast visit our website@the being cast dotcom and click on the subscribe link. If you're an I tunes listener, we've also provided a direct link to the eye teens music store, or just search for the being cast in the pod cast directory of I tunes and whichever pod guests directory you use when you subscribe, please leave observe. You got a comment of a question we
love to hear from you just syndrome emails to being cast a female dotcom opening theme was performed by Joseph Cambell closing theme by sea jacks. Thanks for listening. I'm Bob nor we'll be back again next week. Hope you'll join us then.